Saw this one today and had to share.
I must say I feel like this quite often, especially more recently with all the issues we’ve been seeing (in the past 5-10 years).
I mean no disrespect whatsoever to the Dev Team as I know they work very hard on the product, but some days, us outsiders truly feel abandoned and let down, resulting in Memes like this one.
It’s pretty bad when I am now more fearful of Patch Tuesday because of what it will break rather than looking forward to what it might fix!
Ok, one more!
I can’t help myself, one last one.
No really, last one this time
Love em!
Worst part is they are accurate.
Glad you enjoy.
Hate to be negative, but that is how I feel about it sometimes too!
Big difference between being negative vs. realistic and truthful!
Just took a look at https://survey.stackoverflow.co/2022 which gives some hints as to % of where developers are going. From a survey, so take w/ salt.
Of the entire survey, the phrase “Microsoft Access” does not appear. At ALL. That is, :Not found:
If I were considering further investment in a database, why would I invest in :Not found: ??? Where would I find developers to work on it? Etc.
Time to move on…
Still, it’s a great RAD tool, and i’ll use it for that.
Yes, I seen such surveys in the past, but counterbalance that with https://db-engines.com/en/ranking where Access has actually gained traction.
https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/access-blog/access-issues-fixed-in-the-may-2022-monthly-release/ba-p/3535339
I think MSA Team is still active and not abandoning Access.
Sorry, but after seeing nothing, no new features in years, a basically blank roadmap, a pile of non-stop bugs, I’ve lost the enthusiasm you still show.
I also said, “feels like”, I know the Dev Team is active, just not releasing anything beyond bug fixes, lots of those as proven by your own link!
I share your concern and despair that a substantial project I was about bid for, with MS Access and SQL Server, I now cannot risk taking on. The new bug frequency in such a mature and highly stable product, is completely unacceptable. My credibility with existing clients using this technology, now hangs by a thread as it is only a matter of time, before they hear the bad news about Access or are directly affected by a bug that I have no control over. If these problems are not intentional, so that we are forced to abandon Access and move to the PowerApps revenue stream for MS, then this is the lowest level of competence I’ve seen from MS ever, even since day one in the 1980’s.
Indeed. The whole MS365/Azure is pure revenue for MS. Why do you think MS is pushing so hard to get everyone in the cloud. This is a way to lock you in and everything is extra. Everything is about data or Money nowadays, everything!
Mine took several hits over the years, and recently again thanks to Azure Web Services. This is why I no longer recommend Access, nor Azure anymore. I used to be a driving force behind numerous clients buying Office licenses, but it no longer makes sense to me. I have migrated to open-source technologies hosted either internally, or using 3rd party providers that I have control over. Having changes imposed, updates continuously breaking mission critical apps, no longer (moving forward).
the last 25 years we have build an complete ERP solution for our company running on MSAccess / Office. We have started to move parts of our application to open-source technologies two years ago.
And after the update desaster last week we decided to abandon Access at all.
So, Daniel, even tho Access has gained traction, you and Gavin and I are already down the road.
Until we meet again …
So, you your (all of you) opinion, what is a viable FE for SQL Server? Is there even such an animal?
Daniel and others,
If moving away from MS Access, then what front-end/rad tool are you moving to or recommending?
I have chosen to go with PHP (then the designer is the app of your choice), but there are numerous other options such as: .Net, any of the Visual Studio languages, …
I actually like having gone with a web language as now my solution are true Web Apps: can be hosted almost anywhere (so no longer hostage of Microsoft or anyone else for that matter), runs on any device (Windows, MAC, tablets, cell phones, …), nothing to install on user’s device beyond a link to a URL, no more messing around with bitness issues in code or ActiveX controls, I find there are more functionalities available, more modern look and feel, I also find it remarkably responsive, … So far (3+ years now), I am very happy with having made the switch.
It’s actually fascinating when you look at that DBEngines ranking.
There are SO MANY of the “up and coming” Db technologies that pale in frequency of use when compared to Access, and it’s kind of fascinating to realize that Access remains almost as popular is IBM’s venerable DB2!
This is not to say that there aren’t serious SENIOR Management issues at Microsoft in regards to the stability questions with Access (and their whole software development/directions mantra writ large), but there remains some “intractable” forces which mitigate TOWARDS use of Access continuing.
…and DataVerse isn’t even ON THE LIST!
Not sure if it ever will, don’t forget Dataverse is Azure behind the scenes, so it may get put into the Azure/SQL Server pile.
The problem with the DBEngines ranking is: “The DB-Engines Ranking does not measure the number of installations of the systems, or their use within IT systems”, so it isn’t based on true usage. The other issue now also being that Access comes with almost every installation these days, but doesn’t mean it is actually used. So even installation stats do not tell the proper picture. This is the big problem with evaluating the true reach of Access. Add to that differentiating Access the database (JET/ACE) from Access the RAD GUI is never done!
For those looking at the database engine rankings – I hope you realize that “Access” isn’t a database engine. Jet and ACE are database engines. Access is an application development platform. When people complain about the shortcomings of “Access”, they are 99.9% complaining about Jet and ACE. You can tell because they denigrate “Access” as they compare it to a different RDBMS. Well folks, Access just isn’t a RDBMS and it doesn’t deserve at least that part of the bad press.
Access is a mature product and shouldn’t have lots of updates no matter how you and I feel about it. Large numbers of companies depend on Access to run their businesses. In recent years (mostly since the push to O365), MS has inserted some HUGE bugs causing considerable problems to my clients and to the reputation of Access. I appreciate that MS has an insurmountable problem in that they are trying to support an extreme variation in OS, Hardware, networks, RDBMS, and Access itself and so it’s really hard to test every single combination of the various moving parts. So, much as I would love to see some new controls and functionality that makes ODBC work over the internet almost as well as it works over a LAN, I want MS to think very carefully about what they actually change and to stop making changes just for the sake of change. It keeps the children happy but not the people who depend on Access to run their business.
New features that are buggy aren’t going to send my world crashing down around me but breaking existing features causes great pain for me and all of you. I think that a large part of the breakage is caused by changes to Windows and the shared Office libraries and relate to security. You’d think by now MS would have learned to test Access thoroughly when making these types of changes since it seems to be the canary in the coal mine.
I would feel ever so much better about MS’ commitment to Access as a life form if they would stop ignoring it in their marketing. It is an asterisk in most versions of O365 that include it. Access should be front and center as a FE to SQL Server. It is such a simple way to create an application that even if it isn’t the end result, development teams should be using it as a modeling tool. Instead, experienced developers turn up their nose at Access and think of it as a toy. Many times because of the bad press spread by the SQL Server development team. They were the source of the “Access is dead. Long live SQL Server” rumors of 2000 and 2006. The earlier rumor was because MS decided to ship a desktop version of SQL Server “in the box” and the later was because the Access team copied Jet (which had been managed by the SQL server team) and made it into ACE. So since Jet was dead, the SQL Server team told everyone who would listen that “Access” was dead. The latest rumor they spread was when MS cancelled Access Web Apps. Apparently the SQL Server team looks at the engine popularity list and is afraid that “Access” is a competitor when it is not. Too bad. If they actually knew what “Access” was, they could be Access’ best sales force.
All excellent points.
It is the reversing course on features, waste updates on useless features and the never ending onslaught of bug that has made Access an unviable production application these days.
Yes, but the average person doesn’t know this and even the page doesn’t make that distinction, so Access it is for the sake of discussion. This has always been a sticky point in forums …
Thank you Daniel for bringing some levity to this insanity. I particularly liked the cruise ship! I little over the top but does drive the point home.
My company is currently evaluating whether or not we should ditch Access and even Office. There are a number of viable options being considered. I think they are leaning towards Google, not sure that will be any better. It will be interesting to see what the future holds.
Several of my clients run on Google Docs and I’ve never heard of a single issue. (but I’m still not a fan of Google) I’ve also setup several on LibreOffice.
If I had one recommendation, migrate your data to an open-source database, PostgreSQL is one solid option.
Actually they have made a big change very recently – on the cloud front:
Access Connector for Dataverse and Power Platform Is Released
https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/access-blog/the-access-connector-for-dataverse-and-power-platform-is/ba-p/3354250
“We built this because Access customers told us they need more hybrid solutions that keep the value and ease of use of Access with the value, security, and flexibility of cloud-based storage and development platforms. ”
Lets see if this web / cloud enhancements stays or is dropped like previous attempts.
DataVerse is far from innovative. You could already do this with Azure SQL for years now and I personally have.
At the same time, users have been asking for many other things and with more intensity that this. If you review the analysis of UserVoice data it is clear MS isn’t listening to its users, never has. They are good at selling their own storyline! Lines like the one you quoted are simply good PR and it obviously works.
Was it truly worth 2-3 years invested in something you could already do instead of say addressing all the bugs and stability issues! Forget actually bringing the product forward with a proper SQL Editor, it is a database after all.
There also the fact that even after 2-3 years invested in this, DataVerse still cannot handle all of Access’ data types … leaving it unusable for many. It is just one more example of Microsoft continuous “in-development features”. Do you want to be Microsoft test dummy while they try to figure things out. Are you willing to bet your data on that?
Moreover, with DataVerse you loose a lot of control, shereas with Azure SQL you have full control. It a question of 6 of one and half a dozen of another, not saying one is better than the other. Some will prefer not having to administer DataVerse, while others will hate the loss of capabilities and much prefer Azure SQL Databases.
Oh, Microsoft will make their moneys with this and push many over to DataVerse and PowerApps, … no doubt there. They are thinking of MS, not Access at the end of the day and who can blame them, they are there for the shareholders, not the users.
I thought it go something like that. Thanks for your view.
You as well. Thank you for sharing!
V2206 DEBACLE IS GOING FROM BAD TO WORSE. Latest version 15330.20246 (July 12, 2022) now completely breaks the ACCDE at startup with error:
The expression On error you entered as the event property setting produced the following error: Requested type library or wizard is not a VBA project.
ACCDB still works as before. DoCmd.TransferText still broken with error 3125
Rollback to V2205 fixes this.
The above error that broke our ACCDEs is also evident in Office 2013/2016 via patch that was pushed out yesterday:
KB5002121 in Office 2013
KB5002112 in Office 2016
Removing these patches fixed the problem.
I didn’t experienced any problems with this version Access® 2019 MSO (16.0.14228.20216) 32-bit using SQL server 2012 express SP2 64bit backend.
Count your blessings!
I m seriously grateful to Microsoft Access and Microsoft for many of their tools. And MS Access has taught me everything I know about normalisation and system design and introduced me to programming.
I never got so far as having paid clients with any of my MS Access products and started down the road with PHP web front ends against databases (postgres / mysql or sql server) for many of the same reasons that Daniel has stated. I can’t get to machines easily and PHP generators are now pretty good I have found one that allows me to call stored procedures in databases and pass parameters etc. That combined with CRUD functionality means I can cover most stuff. The bits I am missing from access are – dynamic saving , the pure speed of local systems and the excellent report writer.
I still find Access excellent for linking to SQL Server and doing quick and dirty data manipulation and I have old personal systems that I am never going to have clients for but do not have the time to redesign so will keep using them. Access still is my go to ETL tool.
I never left Access 2003 and the MDB/E format.
Never went with the accdb format, that is a pain to recover in case of trouble, or ribbons. So with it’s start up settings I can make my own clean and completely blank user interface if I want.
Access 2003 is my absolute best RAD environment, it gets things done and fast for frontends.
I use it connected to MDBs/Jet, Oracle, SQL server and Firebird backends.
I prefer developing a MDE front end on Access than developing it on VB and compiling, because I just publish my file with an Access 2007 Runtime kit, which is free to distribute, so no need for paying Access licenses on clients side.
If I wish I develop a web interface in PHP for specific tables/information on those backends too, as PHP has great toolkits like Codeigniter or Laravel that will make creating interfaces rather easy, but not as easy as Access.
As to Office itself, since “clouding” is a way to not waste time deploying interfaces, I found that Nextcloud with it’s Onlyoffice addon attached to a free Onlyoffice server running on a local container makes the ultimate Office solution on any enterprise, and covers the Word/Excel/Powerpoint needs ok, with the files/information not “leaving” the LAN.
Access is for me a daily basis work tool, that got me into the databases world with it’s great development designers. I love the query, form and report builders. I learned a lot with it and still am with the help of the author of this page and others, and it is a shame that with each new version of Access it is not getting any better.
By the way… Thank you for your tips